On the quest for warm,creamy overdrive. Tonelab SE

[dgassie]

After reading a lot of posts, it seems the consensus is that there is no way to get that big, overdriven, tube amp sound at a reasonable volume level. Reasonable, being something that won't get the neighbors, or your significant other pissed and you can use in a small practice room.

Many have said that pedals are the answer to
get the sustain and creamy overdrive I'm after. So I take it that pedals aren't the incarnation of evil I once thought they were. I've been checking up on those "boutique" pedals but thinking about multiple pedals and their corresponding wires running all over the place,
makes me cringe, not to mention all the noise interference I think it would cause. The logical answer would be one of the new multi function pedals out on the market. My only experience with something similar was the Digitech RP50 I had and it was pretty bad. Was this because this was an inexpensive little box or is that what I can expect from the larger multi pedals?

I looked into the Vox SE a little while back. That seems to
pack quite a wallop as far as different effects and functions and a pretty steep price too… but I guess worth it if you consider what three or four of those boutique pedals would cost. It seems to have everything going for it and I'm definitely interested. I would guess a "complete" pedal today would have to have credible amp modeling,
speaker and cab simulation … and a dozen effects right?

Also, you shouldn't be too limited in how many you could use simultaneously and they would have to be USEABLE… none of the outer space invaders, bizango, crap.

I've used the effects on my Yamaha DG60fx amp and have found some of them to be very good. The Clean 2 and Crunch 2 settings are very useable. Both the Lead and Drive settings aren't that believable, at least to my ears. The Compressor seems to work very well, although
I've never heard another to compare it to. I only use the spring reverb on it, since the plate and hall settings sound kind of weird but the Spring sounds great. I haven't really found much use for the Flanger, Chorus and Echo. I'd love for this amp would have a few more distortion effects that could be tweeked by the user, but I guess you can't have everything. Another pain in the butt is the foot controller. It's so hard to use that it's permanent home is in the back
of the cabinet!

So what do you think, would a good multi effects pedal give me what I'm looking for? As always, not being able to walk into a store a screw around with a dozen of these, makes it hard to decide. I haven't even seen the Vox Tonelab SE for sale here in Mexico so I'd have to order it over the internet, without a test drive first.

Dan

[Steelpriest]

Oha? You have a Yamaha DG60 combo amp? I had that one back in the day and considered it as quite good, especially the overdriven sounds were very nice... hmm, the model I had had only a reverb, no FX, maybe that´s what makes the difference. Now I have a Yamaha DG1000 modelling preamp (this 19" preamp with motor pots), it has no effects at all, not even an FX loop. This DG1000 is built in a way that does focus only on the amp modelling and tone. All it´s processor capacity goes into the "sound modelling" and is not misspent on FX gadgets. This makes a big difference to the DG60 combos. It sounds amazing... When I had the DG60 combo I used an old 19" Hughes and Kettner TUBEMAN (it had a ECC83 tube in it) to tickle the preamp section somewhat and make it sound "warmer". I second your opinion that the DG60 had nice crunch sounds but the hotter and more distorted sounds were somewhat "flat-chested" especially when it came to lead playing. My advice is the following: Try a good overdrive pedal if you are satisfied with the other built-in effects of your Yamaha combo amp. "Affordable" multi FX stomp boxes like the Digitech RP50 are, at least in my opinion, not made for being operated between a guitar and the input of an already decent and almost professional amp. These ones are tools for improving little practice amps, or for being used as headphone amps when playing at home... Hmm, I´d say look for a really nice analog overdrive in order just to boost the output of your guitar somewhat, but don´t buy a distortion pedal... Hmm, if you are not able to go to a store and check it out before buying and you have to order it online or from a catalogue, make sure there is a return option in case you are not satisfied with what you purchased.

[dgassie]

Thanks for your reply Mr. Steelpriest. At LAST, some common ground to on the quest for tone!

The DG60fx is an awesome amp. I use it everyday, turning to my Blues Junior only occasionally due to volume issues. I simply don’t have an adequate space to turn it up the BJ and get the tone it’s known for. Besides, I don’t even want to play that loud. When I bought the DG, there was another more expensive model available (I think it was the 80), it had more power and moterized knobs but I didn’t care for controls that moved on their own! All the effects on the DG60fx are very good (I just don’t use most of them) and I would go as far as saying the crunch and clean settings will challenge any tube amp you may want to throw it up against, but as we both agree, the heavy distortion is lacking. This is a very versatile amp that I even use to record into my PC sometimes.

Needless to say, I’m VERY happy with my DG, but am looking for that “creamy” distortion which eludes its capabilities, similar to what you can hear at this site. Check out the LesPaul Deluxe-5Y3/KT66/12AX7 at this site www.emerysound.com/SoundClips.html . Which distortion pedal would give me THAT sound?

Since I live in Mexico Steel, returns are not an option due to tariffs and local taxes. Some gear is available here but most of the time the selection is very limited. I have to special order gear or buy through the internet. I’ve heard some very good things about the Vox Tonelab SE and am interested. Another reason I’m leaning towards the Vox is the pedals and the programmable effects on the footswitches, as you know, the DG foot controller is a just nightmare.

So if possible, please let me know what you would recommend to get that distortion sound I’m looking for.

Dan Gassie (See? I had to get a DG amp)
;D

[Steelpriest]

Well, I took a look at the Vox Tone Lab... it is more a desktop modelling preamp than an FX pedal and quite expensive. In my opinion such an amount of money spent to upgrade your DG´s sound and put it between guitar and amp seems pretty senseless. On the other hand yould use your DG combo only as a powered cabinet if it has an poweramp input... If you like the Vox tonewise I´d suggest to sell the DG combo and purchase a VOX AD60 VT combo maybe. I think that would save you some money... Hmm, if you have a limited budget I suggest to try the Boss OD1 overdrive or the Ibanez TS7 Tubescreamer. Well, I listened to the soundclip on that site you mentioned. I know what you are looking for... a smooth and warm overdriven blues tone. May I suggest taht you might try a Laney LC30 combo? This is a full tube combo with only 30 watts and it sounds exactly like I imagine want you are looking for. Take a look... www.harmony-central.com/Events/SNAMM97/Other/LC30.html

Just found out they have even an LC15 full tube combo. You should be able to crank it up, get a very nice tone, without tearing the roof off, lol ;D Take a look at it! www.laney.co.uk

Back to the Yamaha DG series. I also had the Yamaha DG Stomp (as well a desktop modelling preamp) it was amazing, but the DG1000 cannot be beaten. No FX, just a preamp that delivers nothing but tone... in lead II mode and with almost full gain it sounds exactly like my old Marshall JCM 800 heads. There is in any case a difference between the DG 60, 80, stomp box and the 19" DG1000 preamp concerning the tone they are able to deliver. They may all look somewhat alike, but they have different characters. I don´t know much about the Yamaha footcontrollers, my DG60 combo had none. The DG1000 is only midi switchable. The only bad thing about it: I used a midiboard but found out that when switching to another program I had a gap of a few milliseconds in my sound which was annoying. Well, I am the only guitarist in our band, so I don´t need no lead sound that is louder than my rhythm sound. I use the guitars volume control and the DG1000 reacts very dynamic to that, just like an all tube head would. Well, in my opinion the best solution to your quest would be either an affordable overdrive pedal or a total different amp.